minipie

Island extractor - flush to ceiling vs downdraft?

minipie
3 years ago

We're planning a large open plan kitchen/living room (7.3m x 8.8m at its biggest) and would like a gas hob on the island. Trying to decide what sort of extraction is best for us and would appreciate some views, especially from kitchen pros.


The ceiling above the hob will be 2.8m high, although there will be a section of the room (sitting area) which is 3.1m high. We will have an opening skylight near the hob, as well as various other bits of glass. The kitchen area will be mostly within a new flat roofed extension so we should have plenty of options in terms of ducting, external motor etc, if we plan it in now.


I'd prefer to avoid a hanging box from the ceiling, so if we have a ceiling extractor it would probably be at 2.8m (though the max recommended height seems to be about 2.4 or 2.5m). I have seen a ceiling extractor at 2.8m in a friend's house and it seems to work fine.


I've read that downdrafts are not as effective as ceiling, however there seems to have been improvement recently? Perhaps a downdraft would be better than a ceiling mounted extractor at 2.8m?


Are downdrafts compatible with gas or will they just suck the flame sideways? I've read good things about Bora but not sure if they offer a gas option?


Thanks for any thoughts. Not the most exciting topic but makes a big difference to day to day life!


Comments (40)

  • PRO
    Koivu Ltd
    3 years ago

    Hi minipie, we are a kitchen design studio and nearly all our recent designs had a hob in the island, so we know all about this problem.

    Firstly, if you want a ceiling extractor, there are some options that are level with the ceiling, so they are not very noticeable and do not come down into the room (so no banging of heads!). Westin produce good quality ones, although they are not cheap.

    For the best possible extraction, we would highly recommend the Bora hob. We have now sold quite a few of these and at the moment, cannot find a better quality downdraft extractor on the market (many companies now offer these, but they are not as good). Bora have been producing these hobs for over 10 years and this is all they do, so they have a wealth of expertise as well as over 50 patents!

    Bora have a gas option on their classic model and the flames do not get affected by the extraction. You can even have the option to have half gas and half induction if you wanted. If you get a chance to see one working you will be amazed.

    Feel free to contact us for more information.

  • minipie
    Original Author
    3 years ago

    Thank you! sounds like I should have a better look at Bora. I just realised the ceiling extractor option wouldn't allow ideal placement of our skylight (we could still have one but it wouldn't line up with other ceiling glass... picky picky!) so downdraft has a big benefit there.

    Do you think the extraction of a Bora downdraft is as good as a Westin ceiling? Also is there a big difference in noise?

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  • minipie
    Original Author
    3 years ago

    Interesting, thank you. Not in a rush to make final choice though we need to have a "working" decision for planning permission purposes (since the choice affects the skylight configuration). I am leaning towards the Westin since we could then have free choice of hob and also the remote motor option is appealing.. Do you know whether it's possible to have the remote motor on the roof, as our kitchen will be in a flat roof extension?

  • Mel Mo
    3 years ago
    I'm in the same situation. I've never come across Westin so I just tried to Google the price of the stratus flush extractor; every website says POA/ contact for price. How expensive can it be?! Any ideas?
  • minipie
    Original Author
    3 years ago

    Just asked my architect and he reckoned about £2000 (gulp) but that is for quite a big size

  • Jonathan
    3 years ago
    You could look at Airuno for the ceiling extractor or let your kitchen designer guide you towards a competitive brand.
    You would need an induction hob with a downdraft extractor and they do limit the size of drawers underneath to 350mm deep.
  • minipie
    Original Author
    3 years ago

    Hmm that definitely points towards the ceiling option, thanks Jonathan. Those under hob drawers are crucial and I definitely want gas.

  • Suzanne C
    3 years ago

    Minipie, how big do you think your island will be? If the depth is 900 or 1200mm then you could have full size drawers at the front under the hob and void at the back with reduced drawers on the other side..


    We are currently designing our kitchen and we had the same dilemma, I was adamant I wanted full drawers under the hob.

  • Jonathan
    3 years ago
    Just been thinking that it is easier to duct a ceiling extractor.
    If your downdraft is recirculating it won’t clean the air in the room as well as a ducted ceiling extractor.
    Furthermore if you have ducting you can have an external motor which is quieter and will likely be more powerful than an internal motor and this is useful in large open plan rooms.
  • PRO
    Koivu Ltd
    3 years ago

    Hi minipie, just to give you some more technical information - the height of the Bora hob is 196mm, which means you will only lose about 20cm from the top of your worktop (so if your worktop is quite thick, you won't lose much space from the drawers). We often put two very deep pan drawers under the hob and this works really well.

    With regards to extraction, the main point of it is to get rid of smells (how often do you have your extractor on when you are just boiling peas?) so extraction at the source has to be more effective, as the smells have less chance of escaping into the room. Bora offer an option to duct under the island, so you could always do that instead of recirculating. However, recirculating is still the most popular option for most people.

    Don't forget to add up the cost as well and see which option works best for you financially.

  • PRO
    Koivu Ltd
    3 years ago

    With regards to the remote motors on the Westin - you have two options. One is an inline motor that sits along the ducting line and the other is an external motor that goes on an external wall of the house (not sure if the roof would be ideal for this). You can see this on the Westin website: http://www.westin.co.uk/our-hoods/remote-motors/

  • minipie
    Original Author
    3 years ago

    Thanks everyone!

    sbcbc, it will be about 900-1000 deep, so yes we could do that. I would like a utensil drawer below the hob, I think. Still don't like the idea of being tied to a bora gas hob...

    Jonathan, we are building the extension from scratch so should be able to have ducted for either option (I'd hope?) and should also hopefully be able to have an external motor for either. Ducting would be shorter and straighter for the ceiling option though as, presumably, it could go straight up through the flat roof above the hob, rather than having to make it out to the back wall.

    Koivu, thanks, I wonder why the roof is not a good place for the motor... maybe it's not solid enough? Happy to have an external motor on the back wall if necessary as our rear elevation has a slightly hidden corner anyway. Is an inline motor any quieter than simply having the motor as part of the extractor?


  • PRO
    Koivu Ltd
    3 years ago

    I think the quietest solution will be the exterior one and also probably the easiest to get to if service is required. We can get more information from Westin if you have an agreed plan and also get a quote from them for cost.

  • HU-809736292
    2 years ago

    Hi - sorry to jump on this thread but we have the same dilemma as want a gas hob on the island but we have a skylight directly above the island. Has anybody seen flat panel ceiling extraction built into rooflight void/recess - not sure if this would work as ceiling height 2.8m and presumably if sideways effect will be negligible. We've been recommended a bora domino unit (can't seen to find the gas option just the duo with gas and induction?) but loathe to lose drawer space (appears that Elica bringng out a NikolaTesla Flame built in unit later this year but not sure if available in the UK yet. Any thoughts / suggestions most welcome. Thanks

  • minipie
    Original Author
    2 years ago

    Honestly if you have a skylight directly above the hob I think downdraft is your only option. You could perhaps have the skylight as an opening one (definitely do this if you can as otherwise fumes and grease will collect there) plus extractor fan in the reveal to draw fumes up into the skylight recess... no idea how well this would work

  • dowleredward
    2 years ago

    Thanks mini pie - having motorised / venting skylight above island and going to opt for Elica NikolaTesla Flame has Hob with built in Downdraft extraction. Thanks for help!

  • mdineen01
    last year

    Just wondering about downdrafts ... we were thinking about the Bora Pure but we often do stir fries and I was worrying about oil splatters getting everywhere so we're now looking at a Novy Panorama instead. Can anyone comment on the effectiveness of a vented hob vs downdraft and has anyone any thoughts on downdraft extraction rates vs noise? We have to go recirculating, can't go externally ducted unfortunately.

  • PRO
    OnePlan
    last year

    Add a wall mounted expelair type extractor that extracts a min of 60lps somewhere in the room ... much cheaper and will keep building regs happy.

  • mdineen01
    last year

    Thank you @OnePlan - the hob will be in the island, around 2m from any wall and it's a passive house so from what I've read with passive houses, recirculation is recommended? We're building a freestanding house in a rural area so I don't think building regs will be an issue. Looking up Expelair now ...

  • PRO
    OnePlan
    last year

    It’s usually better to take air out in kitchen than block up the filters more often in your mvhr system ... but confirm status with installer and building control before you decide .

  • mdineen01
    last year

    Thanks for that. I totally agree. What "surprised" me about the demo of one of the vented hobs I saw was that it was exceptionally pricey but when I commented on its inability to extract vapour, the kitchen supplier suggested that the mvhr would do it. I would have thought that any vendor would ensure its "premium" product didn't have to rely on a third party to do its work for it.

  • PRO
    Luke BORA ASM London
    last year

    hi mdineen01 if you have any questions on the BORA Pure please let me know.

  • mdineen01
    last year

    Hi Luke - thank you. I do actually - I saw a demo of it and to be honest I thought that a lot of the vapour from the saucepan of boiling water didn't get sucked into the vent so I could imagine the ceiling over the cooktop would become discoloured. It's possible that it wasn't installed correctly where it was being demo'ed. I was also looking for something with a bridge function and I was concerned about grease splatters so the Pure wasn't the right appliance for us. It's a beautiful looking appliance and I was beyond disappointed that it doesn't seem to be the one for us. The island we're installing doesn't have multiple levels on it - it's a flat surface - and I wonder how you'd contain grease splatters. It's not that we cook fried foods very often - but it's more about having some kind of barrier between the cooktop and someone sitting at the island. Any comments / thoughts would be appreciated. Again, thank you.

  • Martin
    last year

    We're doing as @OnePlan suggests, 60l/s extractor mounted on the ceiling in the corner of the room

  • mdineen01
    last year

    @Martin Would you be able to share the brand and model you're going for?

  • Martin
    last year
    last modified: last year

    I'm still searching, there seems to be some good enough cheap ones under £30 around but I think we'll go for something nicer. Possibly Silent 300 CRZ or our electrician yesterday suggested the ICON 60 which looks quite neat. Although the reviews are no better for those than for the cheap ones

  • PRO
    Luke BORA ASM London
    last year


    @mdineen01 what showroom did you view this in? I have demoed & cook many times on the Pure & it’s extremely efficient at getting all the vapour & grease. If you cook say bacon / stir fry / steak etc you will get grease spotting / splatters around the extractor ...then at the end of your cook you just wipe it away. Put the nozzle & grease filter in the dish washer done. I can assure you that someone sitting on the other side of the island is not going to get covered in grease. We do the BORA basic that can have zones that are bridged & then come March next year we will do the X pure that is a 90cm hob that is flex induction (bridgeable zones) . I hope that helps.

  • mdineen01
    last year

    Thank you @Luke BORA ASM London That does help - a lot. I think I might find a different showroom and take another look and it may be worth waiting for the X pure.

  • PRO
    Luke BORA ASM London
    last year

    where do you live? can you come to our London showroom? to take alook?

    the X pure is still very .... top secret say but this link should give you an idea of look & some info https://design.museaward.com/winner-info.php?id=999

  • anj_kumar
    last year

    Hello I know this is an older thread, but I am also looking at downdraft solutions as I want the job in the island and don’t really want a ceiling extractor. The Elica NikolaTesla is a lovely gas hob. Can anybody confirm if this needs to be ducted out or is it recirculating? Thanks

  • PRO
    KITCHENS AND BATHROOMS
    last year

    Hi,

    Hope you don't mind me getting in touch!

    My name is Lucy and I'm working on a new TV series about people renovating their kitchens.

    We would love to hear from people in the UK who have ordered/near ordering their kitchen. The show is documentary style, with a well-known presenter who has over 20 years experience in the building trade. I wonder if this may be of interest to you? If so, please pop me an email with a contact number, budget, and brief description of timescale to Lucy.Cooper@PiProductions.tv. Kind regards, Lucy

  • HU-962351650
    8 months ago

    Hi there. Looking for some related advice. We''re also ordering a new kitchen and are trying to decide on an extractor. The only issue is that the ceiling is about 3.25-3.5m high so everyone keeps telling us to have a bulkhead over the island as a ceiling mounted extractor will be inefficient otherwise (we're told a height of more than 1.5m above the hob is the maximum; ours will be about 2.2m...). We really don't want anything hanging from the ceiling over the kitchen island as it is in an open space and will ruin the whole open plan concept. Do you know of any flush ceiling mounted extractors with motors which are strong enough to work at that height? Currently looking at Falmec, Sirius and Frecan but would love to hear your suggestions. Thanks in advance!

  • minipie
    Original Author
    8 months ago

    I believe Westin say that for theirs the height doesn’t matter, just that it’s placed at the highest point of the ceiling. 3.25-3.5m is a hell of a height though!

  • HU-962351650
    8 months ago

    @minipie Thanks for your reply. I'll look into Westin. Not sure whether they're available locally. Re ceiling height, I know :( old Maltese townhouses have very high ceilings :( what did you eventually pick for yourselves?

  • minipie
    Original Author
    8 months ago

    Nice problem to have :)


    We have a Novy Pureline - it just pipped Westin on noise stats. It’s installed at more than the supposed maximum height - our ceiling is 2.8m, so 1.9m above the hob, we didn’t drop it with a box, and it works absolutely fine. Especially if we remember to turn it on a few minutes before frying, that makes all the difference to effectiveness.

  • HU-962351650
    8 months ago

    Many thanks for the tips! Really, much appreciated. Thanks again :)

  • C Mc
    6 months ago

    Latest advice appreciated on the best big induction downdraught hobs please (Berbel, Bora, Gaggenau, Siemens, Bosch or others). We want best steam and fat clearance rates, quietest motors, easy-clean (unsure re self-clean, ducted or recirulated air). Berbel's FaceBook page features lots of customer complaints regarding after-sales service and spare parts, but some seem due to Covid delays which we think is unavoidable; another mentions guests sitting "in a haze" from the recirculated air and obviously nobody wants that! We need to order very soon but definitely don't want ceiling extraction. Many thanks for prompt replies!

  • PRO
    Faber Hoods
    5 months ago

    Hello! We offer a range of cooker hoods, including ceiling hoods and downdraft extractors! Many of our hoods feature LED lighting to illuminate the hob below, we even have an island cooker hood that looks like a chandelier! (This is the Nest Plus that features Up and Down technology)

    Our Fabula downdraft extractor reaches 700 m³h - an impressive extraction rate that would suit a large kitchen area. If you would like to know more, please visit www.faberhoods.co.uk

  • HU-17113652
    3 months ago

    I got the Bora as I was impressed with the demo. Unfortunately, it DOES pull the flame when you have gas. That causes heat to "escape" on the side (and if you have the pan/pot handle on that side, it'll be very hot) and very uneven cooking.

Ireland
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